What is it...?

[kriadydragon]

What is it about fictional characters having - or being given - kids that makes them suddenly less interesting? At least for me it does. Is it just me, or are others this way as well?

That's not to say I have no interest in a character when that character has a kid, but my preferences always lean toward characters who don't have kids. If the characters are married, or have been married, it makes no difference. But when kids are involved, suddenly, there's a tad less appeal and I'm not sure why.

And the older the kid, the less the appeal but that I have figured out. Older kids - in TV shows especially - tend to be, or come off as at least, obnoxious, selfish brats whose soul existance is to create conflict and angst for the parent. There are few shows, very few shows, where I liked the children of the main characters. As for books, I rarely read books where the main characters have kids. I have read them - I find the kids in books more tolerable than kids in TV shows and movies - yet despite that, I still shy away from such stories more often than not.

Even when said kid is a baby - or too young to be obnoxious - I'm still a little "meh" about the characters. Maybe it's because having a child means the characters have to settle down, no more adventures, danger, etc? Or, maybe, because much of the character's focus will be on the child, everything centered around the child, the child the main influence behind most of the character's actions (in other words, making the character less complicated)? I'm not against characters having kids, it's just not something that appeals to me. For me, in my own stories, I like the idea of my characters eventually meeting someone and having a family, but it's not something I like to show in the story itself. I like to hint at the idea, that it's something that is happening, or will happen, but "off-screen" long after the adventure is said and done. That's also not to say that I will never write a story where the main character has a kid. Who knows? There's a lot of story ideas I thought I would never touch with a ten foot pole, and yet I have.

Neither am I against kids. I love babies :D and enjoy stories with child or teen main characters just as much as I enjoy stories with adult main characters (many of my own stories are aimed toward young adults). I even enjoy stories where adults work with kids to achieve the same goal. I'm just not as interested in a story when said kids are the children of said adults, but I have no idea why.

What I hate, though, is when a show or story introduces a child right smack in the middle of the plot - where for most of the show or story the character has been childless then *wham* suddenly has a child (usually the product of a one-night stand or sleeping with someone in highschool or something.) Most of the time, in shows especially, the child ends up not being the character's. When it does end up being the character's, my interests in that character starts to flag and fast. But that has more to do with moral issues and dilemmas. I don't like the idea of a character sleeping around so recklessly, and like even less when the show either A) tries to make the character look like a dead-beat dad or a selfish mom or B) has the character attempt to be a parent, suck at it, and the kid isn't helping because they're a snot-nosed and slfish brat (yes, probably with good reason, but it's still annoying.). If the kid was there from the start of the show or story, then I find the situation a lot more tolerable, because at least you know what to expect.

Edit: I feel a little guilty about posting this; that it's making me sound like someone who's anti-kid or anti-fictional-characters-who-have-kids. Of which I am neither. I would one day love to have a family of my own. But in the fictional world, like I said, it just doesn't appeal to me as a plot device. Neither has it led me to utterly dislike a show/story or character.

Comments

[imbecamiel.livejournal.com]

I do know very much what you mean. I think a big part of it may be that the characters I'm interested in are usually incredibly passionate, and throw themselves into their work, whatever that may be. When you have a family, children... it's not that you can't be so wholeheartedly passionate, it's that, generally, you shouldn't be. You need a different focus, rearranged priorities. If they remain so driven regarding their job, it's going to make for a very dysfunctional family life. And I don't think that rearrangement of priorities is a bad thing - quite the opposite, I think it's a very healthy, wonderful thing, and my dream for myself is to one day have a family. But... it just wasn't what I was looking for in that show. So either there's going to be a super dysfunctional family (which I'm not generally very interested in watching - always exceptions, but...), or the character's focus is going to change, which is likely to change the aspects of the show that got me interested to begin with (not that it couldn't still be a good direction that'll keep me interested, but...).

So yes, I definitely agree with the sentiment - I'm very strongly for family myself, but in fiction, especially television, it doesn't tend to appeal as a plot device. Can be done well, but more often tends to make me blah.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

"You need a different focus, rearranged priorities. If they remain so driven regarding their job, it's going to make for a very dysfunctional family life."

Very true. I'm very character focused, in that I watch a show/read a book more for its characters than the overall plot. I like to get to know these characters, their strengths, weaknesses and so on. And it's not that the characters having kids takes away from that completely, but I feel it sometimes does take a little bit away from the characters, because much of their focus will be on the child/family. But if that focus is not on the child/family, then that character comes off as a selfish jerk. It's kind of hard to sympathize with someone who's putting themself first and their family last, whatever their reasons. But when putting the family first, it becomes pretty much the character/s' motivation for just about everything they do. In turn, the character becomes slightly less complicated, therefore slightly less interesting.

But that's just my opinion. For some, I'm pretty sure adding a child to the mix makes a character a lot more complicated, and I don't disagree with that.

[writerjc.livejournal.com]

I think I know what you mean. I'm thinking back over several stories I've read where the characters have gotten married and had children. I suppose for me it depends very much on how the characters are handled. In some cases, the focus is then taken off the character/s I enjoy and placed on this new individual, which I find annoying. This is doubly so when the novel in question is a novel that should be the further adventures of the characters I love. I feel cheated, like they're using the parents as a way to get me to read about someone else and I get that bait and switch feeling.

On the other hand, I've read/seen some things where I didn't so much mind the kids. If the kids weren't the focus and their whereabouts are handled logically and their arrival didn't feel forced, I've been okay with them. But that is a rare case, sadly.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

"In some cases, the focus is then taken off the character/s I enjoy and placed on this new individual, which I find annoying. This is doubly so when the novel in question is a novel that should be the further adventures of the characters I love."

I get annoyed when stories do this - get me all invested in these characters only to dump a whole new set of characters on me. Sometimes I'm okay with it if the new characters are likeable, but that's always been rare for me (more often than not - for me - the new characters are obnxious, whiny brats trying to rebel against their parents.) I've never been a fan of "new generations" stories.

"On the other hand, I've read/seen some things where I didn't so much mind the kids. If the kids weren't the focus and their whereabouts are handled logically and their arrival didn't feel forced,"

One of my favorite fantasy series, the two main characters have kids. It's one of the few books where I didn't mind the kids. In fact, I liked them. They had their place in the story, while at the same time didn't occupy most of the main character's focus. They actually added to the complexity of the characters, which I find to be a rare thing (especially in TV shows.)

[black-raven135.livejournal.com]

Thank you.......
I thought no one would ever point
that out.........
AND you need not feel guilty......
I think there are more out here who would agree,
but reluctant to speak up.
It always happens.
I had some real interest in characters awhile back
in ff, but when they started families and all the
schtick involved, I lost interest.
I just don't care to spend my time reading about the
trials and tribulation of bringing up children. To me
it is like watching episodes of 7th Heaven, which
does not interest me in the least
Finally, I do NOT hate kids.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I was a little worried that I was coming off as all anti-family, which I'm not. Not by a long shot. I'm utterly pro family and pro children. Just not so much in the fictional world until after the adventure is said and done ;) I think those who commented above made good points as to why the appeal may lessen when kids are involved.

But, again, that's not to say giving characters kids is wrong or doesn't work. Like with most things, it all comes down to how it's handled, and I've seen shows and read stories where it not only worked, but worked very well. But, again, as mentioned in my other replies, such things tend to be rare, or at least for me they are.

[sholio]

Just to be a voice from the other side of the ravine, I actually like it -- but only if it's done well. I like seeing "normal" families on TV -- and by that I don't mean that there can't be fantastic or unusual elements, but I mean where the kids aren't merely a plot element, or cutesy and over-idealized. I like seeing characters deal with the ups *and* the downs of having kids, and seeing them struggle with juggling their adult lives with the hassles of caring for a kid. I really liked the way Teyla's pregnancy and parenthood was handled (at least up until the last few episodes, where they seemed to forget that she even *had* a kid...). Another show that comes to mind where I really liked the baby/parenthood storyline was "Chicago Hope" (years ago now -- one of the single male characters adopted a baby). And one of my regrets about "Firefly" being cancelled is that they'd done really well at portraying Wash and Zoe as a realistic married couple who discussed the concerns that married couples have (like whether they should have kids, especially given their dangerous lifestyle); I would have liked to have seen whether the show would have gone ahead and dealt further with that. I think I'm particularly drawn to family dynamics in a sci-fi or action setting, because it's so rare, and I think there is the opportunity for a lot of drama and character growth when action-hero types have to deal with a family on top of everything.

But I don't enjoy unrealistically idealized or stereotypical families (which is how the vast majority of kids in fanfic come across to me), and I really don't enjoy shows or stories that are nothing but family dynamics. It's kind of like romance in that regard; I think it can really add a lot to a story if it's done well and doesn't dominate, but for my personal tastes, a little goes a long way.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

"I actually like it -- but only if it's done well."

*Nods* Most definitely, which is where my issue lies - that most of the family/kid dynamic I've come across isn't handled that well. Either the kids are incredibly hard to like or tossed in without any real purpose (well, there is a purpose, but the timing, execution and all around mishandling of it can make that purpose seem a little hard to spot beyond the writers being in desperate need of some kind of conflict).

But there have been times where it has worked, and worked well. In an example I gave in one of the responses, there was a book series I read where the main characters had kids. I actually liked the kids. They weren't brats, they're problems were genuine, and they contributed to the character development without dominating it. Though cautious at first, I did like Teyla's pregnancy, and the situations it created. There was another show (which I won't mention the title of for spoiler reasons) where the addition of a child revealed even more layers to certain characters than previously seen.

So I'm not against it, but I am wary of it. I think the other reason why is because it's been used so much as a means to create angst and conflict. One of my favorite shows currently has an "accidental-pregnancy" plot going on. Abortion was never brought up, and now the two characters are married (which, yes, does make me happy) but I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop: for the show to either kill the child or kill both mom and the baby or something. Because, really, how often does a show go the "happily ever after" route except as a series finale? That's not to say it won't happen, but it's hard to trust that it will. It's what made me a little hesitant toward the whole Teyla-has-a-kid arc at first, because I was afraid the show would do what the show Angel did - have the kid taken away and something wierd happen to him, turning him into yet another problem for Atlantis to face. When that didn't happen, I was able to fully enjoy the addition of Torren.

[flingslass.livejournal.com]

I don't mind when characters have a kid, what I hate is they either take over the show or are never mentioned again. I'm still irritated by Elizabeth, the Star Child in 'V'. (Do you think I should let it go now? It was 25 years ago :D)

I could suggest the movie 'Undercover Blues' with Kathleen Turner and Dennis Quaid. The baby was great and worked well in the story.

Jane Blue: You brought our baby into a knife fight?
Jeff Blue: It was a fair fight. Two of them, two of us...