Readings and Writings and What Not

[kriadydragon]

Heh, don't ask me why but I was thinking of all the classical authors who could be considered whumpers.

Charles Dickens whose Smike from Nicholas Nickleby was the inspiration not only for my character Amrin but also for what I put Amrin through (which I actually feel bad about, actually).

Alexander Dumas

Robert Louis Stevenson (I only read Kidnapped but it had some nice whump).

Tolkein, of course.

And that's all I could really think of though I know I'm probably forgetting a few. I would add Poe but I think he was more into angst than H/C ;P

I think I'm starting to lose interest in reading Young Adult novels. As much as I love the variety YA fantasy offers, the writing style often leaves me wanting. The problem is, YA novels I can trust not to break out with random sex scenes. It's not so much the sex itself that bothers me but you can never say if it'll be fade-to-black or so explicit the first sentence alone has be reaching for the brain bleach, and that makes me wary with adult novels.

And it's so hard to find adult novels that take fantasy beyond elves, dwarves and wizards. Don't get me wrong, I love me some Tolkein-esque type worlds and love urban fantasy, but these days I've been craving books that go crazy with the fantasy. Books like the Alchemaster's Apprentice - not blow-you-away-awesome but wonderfully quirky, or Domino Men, or Neverwhere, or Triumff: Her Majesty's Hero. Stories that don't just think out of the box but blow the box up and put it back together as something else entirely.

Which has a lot to do with my own writing preferences. I adore taking fantasy to new and strange places and really want to read stories that do the same, but finding it is tricky (because I'm also a very character-oriented reader who loves action/adventure, and more often than not seem to find only stories more interested in world-building and politics than character-development).

So after much struggling with my WC fic exchange fic that just kept going and going with no end in sight... I finally scrapped it for a much better idea, one that isn't trying to be a chapter story, and I'm really enjoying writing it. Why it took me so long to come up with this idea after wracking my brain for months, I have no idea

Comments

[sholio]

You should read Whitefire Crossing, if you can get hold of it! :) It's a really fun, action fantasy that's refreshingly different from the typical elves-dwarves-wizards stuff. There's some heavy-duty whump (which isn't really my thing, but I know it's yours) and there's not much romance in it; there is a love interest for the main character and a fade-to-black sex scene, but nothing graphic. (Incidentally, this is something you ought to be aware of in the books I've been recommending everywhere, the Ben Aaronovitch ones -- those do have some graphic sex scenes, especially the most recent one. Nothing more graphic than Dresden Files, but, well, Dresden Files can get pretty graphic.)

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

The thing about the Dresden Files is that - not counting that one scene in... I can't remember which book - it's not that in-your-face about it, is the best way I can put it. It's not fade-to-black but neither is it described down to individual body parts. There was one book I read that... *shudders*... involved nipple suckling and that was it, I was done. And one of my issues with the Felix Castor novels was that I felt the author was a little too blunt with the sexual aspect of the book (he did love using the word "erection.") It wasn't graphic, but it still felt heavy-handed to me. But Dresden files isn't like that. It's there, but it isn't so there that you have to think about it. It's more... you can think about it if you want to but it's easy enough not to. Does that make sense? I don't know how else to describe it.

Your description of Whitefire Crossing definitely caught my interest.

[sholio]

*nodnod* Yeah, that does make sense! When it comes to me, I'm not interested in sex scenes but I don't really mind them being in there, so I just tend to skip them when they occur -- which means I don't generally remember much about the actual content of them, just that they were there. The ones in the Aaronovitch books, especially the latest one, are fairly graphic, but also short; maybe a page or half-page, two or three times in the book. I know they would probably bother you but I'm not sure if they would bother you enough to destroy your enjoyment of the books (which are otherwise quite good).

Whitefire Crossing, though -- I don't think there's anything in there that would be a problem for you; like I said, just one sex scene and it's more implied than right out there. That one's an unqualified recommendation. :D

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

As long as I'm aware that such scenes exist (and so am aware enough to know when to skip them) then I don't mind that they're there. It's when I don't see them coming and I run into them that's the problem (like with the above mentioned book with the *cough* suckling. The premise of the book gave me no real reason to believe that there would be sex, let alone graphic sex. It really did come out of nowhere).

[ninja007.livejournal.com]

In scifi, Harry Harrison really puts his characters through the ringer. His Stainless Steel Rat Series as well as his Deathworld trilogy. They are AWESOME!!

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

I recall you telling me about those but I keep forgetting to check them out :/

[swanpride.livejournal.com]

I know the feeling - I used to read a lot of books intended for youth, but it has been a long time since I found something convinving.

My Stevenson Book was always treasure island. I must have read this one hundrets of times. Dumas - never ever read Dumas in the "not cut down for teenager" version, unless you can appreciate long windeness and a very sexist description of woman.

Have you ever read the Neverending Story? I know that people know the movie, but that's only a shadow of the original book. For that matter, all books by Michael Ende are epic! They might be technical for young adults, but there is a reason they are considered good material for university.

Artemis Fowl was also a pleasant surprise, at least the first three books - I'm not too crazy about the ones after.

CJ Cherryh is an all time favourite of mine, although, yes, there tend to be sex in the books, but it's never random, and her world building and character development is outstanding. I recommend the foreigner series (nothing graphic in there, and the best world she ever build). It's science fiction, though - the only sience fiction I read because the aliens she desripes are actual aliens and not basicall humans who look strange.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Yes, the long-windedness of Dumas. It's why I had a hard time finishing Count of Monte Cristo, though I love his Man in the Iron Mask.

I keep meaning to give The Neverending Story a try since I loved the movie but I keep forgetting to. I really need to compose that list of "Books to read," but keep forgetting to do that as well. Can you tell I'm easily distracted ;)

Artemis Fowl is always on-again, off-again for me. Sometimes I like it, sometimes I don't.

CJ Cherryh, I love her writing style but am wary of her books. I'd tried reading Cloud's Rider but it was just so bleak I couldn't continue. There is a book series of hers I want to try but can't find it anywhere.

[swanpride.livejournal.com]

I bet you read the abridged Version of "Man in the Iron Mask". The complete version annoyed me to no end, because there were all those court ladies, loosing concious at every opportunity (especially whenever the king walked by). But I love the move with Leonardo DiCaprio.

You have to read Neverending Story! You just have to! The movie (the first one, not the american made sequels) is very good, but it can't really capture all the layers in this book. If you want to read about unusual creatures, the one in the movie are the least interesting of them. The book has very impressive ones.

Yeah, it's difficult to get CJ Cherryh complete works, they always seemed to be not available, but I have a nice little collection by now. And really, the foreigner series (Starting with "Foreigner") is her best work. It's a trilogy which became four trilogies (still waiting for the paperback of last part of the fourth trilogy). And no Sex at all until the sixth book, and there it's handled very, very tasteful. Well, the first trilogy is save for you for sure.

[elrhiarhodan]

If you are looking for creature-less fantasy, I highly recommend anything and everything by Patricia McKillip. If you are looking for some classic H/C trope, then you should read the Riddlemaster trilogy. It's probably my favorite three books, ever.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Thanks :D I really need to do a "Books to read" list. People are always recommending stuff but I always forget about it later.

[tancaliel.livejournal.com]

Have you read any Robin Hobb? If not, I recommend her Farseer Trilogy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Hobb#The_Farseer_Trilogy). I guess it's not completely go-crazy-fantasy, but it has a pretty neat take on magic (multiple kinds of it), and there's dragons as an added bonus. ;) Also included: some pretty interesting and well-developed characters, plenty of main character!whump, and a lack of explicit sex scenes, as far as I can recall. These three books are probably some of my favourites of all time. :D

[swanpride.livejournal.com]

And a very depressing first ending and a very forced second ending for the sequel - plus, you don't really have the complete story unless you read the trader series, too, and this one is very explicit. It's certainly a good read, but especially the Farseer Trilogy squicks me at times, not with the sex, but with the abuse aspect.

[tancaliel.livejournal.com]

Uh, yeah, I suppose I probably should have mentioned the Farseer Trilogy also has fairly massive amounts of angst at times.

I assume by "sequel" you're referring to the Tawny Man trilogy, not the second book in the Farseer one? I didn't like that one as much as Farseer, though it was still an okay read, and I actually can't for the life of me remember the ending to that one. Whoops.

I haven't gotten around to the Liveship Traders trilogy yet... the fact that it's supposedly very nautical-themed is putting me off. Boats aren't really my thing. ;)

[swanpride.livejournal.com]

Yep, and the end isn't worth remembering.

Gory themes withstanding, I like the Liveship Traders the best. It has the most interesting evil character I ever read about. And yeah, considering that some of the main characters are talking ships, there is a heavy nautical element in it, but more than half of the books are set ashore.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

I tried a Robin Hobb book but couldn't finish it (can't remember which one it was). Not because it was bad or anything (the character development was wonderful) but it had a lot of hurt with no comfort and though I liked one of the main characters, the other MC really rubbed me the wrong way.

Though I might think about giving her another try since my tastes have changed, some.

[aim2misbhave.livejournal.com]

If you've read Neverwhere, you're probably aware of American Gods, which I think is hands-down the best, most outside-the-box adult fantasy book ever. There is a very explicit sex scene early on (the only one I can remember), but if you can get past that somehow, it's very much worth it - there's lots of amazing writing, you can never tell what's going to happen next, and at one point there's some very heavy-duty character whumpage going on. It's all about developing the main character as you realize who the other are, and because it's set in the USA, politics and world-building are unnecessary.

Kraken by China Mieville is another book that reminds me a lot of Neverwhere meets Cory Doctorow, and I don't remember it having any sex at all. The writing isn't stellar, but the setting and the absolutely fantastic references to geek/nerd culture everywhere make up for that IMO.

I also highly recommend Sunshine by Robin McKinley. It's a really unique take on the whole vampire concept, and the author realistically confronts some of the issues that other vampire novels tend to gloss over and/or assume are tropes that their readers have come to accept. There is some oblique discussion of sex, and one almost-sex scene that's less than a paragraph.

If you're looking for a more urban fantasy type thing, I'd suggest checking out the graphic novel Fray. It's a short, easy, and has no sex that I can remember. I don't remember who wrote it (maybe Joss Whedon?) but I know it's published by Dark Horse Comics.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

American Gods I've been considering but I'm wary when it comes to anyone tackling religious matters. What about Anansi Boy? That one I was curious about as well. If you've read it, is it worth a read?

China Melville, I love his writing style but his character development always leaves me wanting. I tried reading Scar and Un Lun dun but couldn't finish them because I couldn't get attached to the characters.

I've heard lots of good things about McKinley, but I can never find any of her books (well, the ones that people rec'ed to me, that is. But I seem to have nothing but bad luck when it comes to trying to find rec'd books).

Oh, graphic novel. I do like a good graphic novel. Thank you :D

[aim2misbhave.livejournal.com]

I have read Anansi Boys, and it's pretty good, although it's not one of my favorite Gaiman novels and it does heavily involve religion/myth as well - one of the characters makes an appearance in American Gods. Whichever one you read first, you'll catch on to what's going on in the other one faster.

But, American Gods happily doesn't even touch Christianity, Islam, or Judaism (the three that tend to spark the most controversy), so it ends up being like an exploration of some of the more obscure, barely-practiced, kinds of religious and cultural beliefs that contributed to "American" culture (It mentions Norse, Egyptian, Celtic, Hindi, and Russian deities among others) and really non-judgmental. The only people I know who are offended by the religious content of the book are Christians who get upset about the implication that Christianity is no more "right" than any other religion.

Oh, and have you read Good Omens? It is also sort of religious in that it's a satire of the Christian apocalypse and The Omen and Nostradamus, but I grew up in a church that was a little obsessed with the apocalypse so I found it really hilarious.

I understand about Mieville's character development, it was more of the setting in Kraken that kept me going through it. I haven't read the other two you mentioned but I read Perdido Street Station, and I had a bit of a phobia of caterpillars to start with D-: and btw, if you're averse to insects in any form, don't even think of reading it.

And I've actually had the most luck finding copies of Sunshine in places that sell used books.

[ladyniko.livejournal.com]

Oh, check out Michelle Sagara's "Cast in..." series from Luna books.

No sex, no real romance - the female lead isn't ready for that, she's too busy trying to figure out what she's supposed to be doing to prevent the next catastrophe.

Very cool fantasy series that I can't wait for the next book to come out.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Awesome :D I really want to read more adult oriented novels but I don't trust them since a lot of authors like to stick their heads neck-deep in the gutter, and I'm sick of it.

[flingslass.livejournal.com]

I'm rereading Christopher Stasheff's A Wizard in Rhyme series (I got me a Kobo :)) I seem to be quite bored with a lot of current novels.