Just Wondering

[kriadydragon]

Okay, so if you read reviews and comments like I do (it's a good way to know what I'm about to get into) you've probably come across some reader either begging or trying to convince the author to include a particular pairing (or avoid a particular pairing), or to make the story a particular genre. It's not so much people telling the writer how to write, but hoping to convince the writer to go in a particular direction.

What I'm wondering is if anyone else finds it... presumptuous verging on being kind of pushy. I don't know, it's just something that bugs me whenever I see it. It's not that they're rude about it, but I guess it bothers me that they go in making the automatic assumption that the author would be okay with the suggestions, but without knowing whether or not that author really is okay with that pairing or that genre or those various notions (like in this one comment I read today, in which the person inquires as to whether the story might be slash in the future - even though the author has stated on their bio that they're not a fan of slash - then said that no pairings would be fine as well, especially male/female pairings - going under the assumption that the author also isn't a fan of het. I personally tend to get a lot of "This should be a reveal fic" or "will this be a reveal fic" or "this story would have been much better with a magic reveal").

It bothers me personally because

1. I hate being told what to write, and especially hate being made to feel that my stories are only good when they involve whatever trope or genre happens to be popular. I don't mind suggestions, but only when I ask for them.

2. Even though we all or will do it at various points throughout our lives, I dislike it when people make assumptions and jump to conclusions without gathering all the facts.

3. Being the selfish reader that I am, I do admit to a certain amount of fear - depending on the author - that the author will go in the suggested direction. Some of these people are pretty insistent, and will even go so far to say that if the author goes in said direction it will make their story more popular. And I can totally see young or newbie fanficcers buying into this, even if it's not a pairing or genre they're particularly thrilled about.

I'm pretty sure the vast majority of ficcers are neither here nor there about it. And that most readers pay no attention to such comments. But for those who have come across such comments whether in your own stories or someone else's story, I'm curious to know what you think.

Comments

[timespirt.livejournal.com]

I think it's up to the writer to write the way they want the story. If they don't like it they can write their own stories and do them the way they want. It's a privilege to even get to read what is written. Bitching about how a writer should write a story that they have pored their time and imagination into is pretty selfish on the person trying to get a writer to do what they want!

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I don't really get people who "offer up suggestions" or try to get a writer to go in a particular direction. If the writer asked for suggestions and ideas that's one thing, but most writers go into their story usually with a plot and direction in mind, and some go in with the story already written (another annoyance for me is when people offer suggestions to a story I wrote in which I state at the start that the story has been completely written). Plus most people seem to go with these suggestions having no idea where the author stands on the things being suggested.

[rabidchild.livejournal.com]

Personally, those comments make me want to do the opposite of whatever the person says. I dislike people telling me how to plot or characterize intensely. I like to feel that I'm pretty good at characterization and plotting, and that it's my story to tell. If someone wants a trope or a pairing so much, they're free to write it. God, anytime I get a comment like that, my reply is usually something so unengaged, like, "Thanks for commenting!" or similar.

But I see what you mean about such comments affecting a younger or more inexperienced writer, and it kind of makes me sad. I think a person needs to be free to tell the story that's in their brain, and if it works or not is up to them, but it's their right to work it out for themselves. To suggest they'd get more reviews or whatever is kinda heinous, and manipulative, and not cool.

Of course, this is all outside a very different situation, and that'd be if a writer's expressed the desire for concrit, but I don't think that's what you mean.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Of course, this is all outside a very different situation, and that'd be if a writer's expressed the desire for concrit, but I don't think that's what you mean.

I think even if concrit and suggestions are asked for people still need to be careful about tromping in and tossing any old idea out there. I don't think people often realize what asking for concrit and suggestions might result in, and some people don't really pay attention when it comes to what an author has and hasn't written. And as a result you get someone suggesting, for example, a scene of explicit porn to an author who wants nothing to do with porn (in fact I think that sort-of happened to someone once, although if I remember correctly it was someone leaving a nonsensical review alluding to how there needed to be sex or something, and the author thinking they were nuts).

But, generally speaking, people should always think before they comment. I recall this one story in which a reviewer kept bashing this one character. But it was obvious from both the story and the author's previous works that the character being bashed was the author's favorite. I would have liked to have seen how the author responded, but it being FF.net I couldn't.

[ninja007.livejournal.com]

I think a writer should write their story with NO influence from readers. It's the reason I hate it when the movie industry have groups of people watching films to decide if the ending they chose was the right one. Stupid.

I also have found certain - shippers - to be pretty demanding and pushy. I find it annoying.

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Yeah, especially since some people don't always have the best ideas about what makes a good story. "Oh, an ending in which everyone dies because it's all so hopeless? Well, it's dramatic and a twist and that kind of stuff is supposed to be what makes a story good, so go with that." :P

[radioshack84.livejournal.com]

For me, it's one of those things that depends entirely on the circumstance of the moment (the comment that was made, the tone of the comment, my mood at the time, how invested I am in what I'm writing/have written, etc.)

Usually, if it's just a suggestion, i.e. "I'd like to read a sequel to this story that explores situation X more thoroughly if you're so inclined to write one" then I'm not bothered, the exception to that being if I've spent a lot of time on a one-shot until I feel that it's self-contained and fully addresses the plot just the way I want. In that instance, I've occasionally been annoyed at requests for additional material since I feel it would ruin the story's intended tone, but I try not to be bothered too much since I know everyone has their own ideas of what they'd love to read and I can't begrudge someone for offering inspiration. :)

That said, I've been thinking a lot about this topic myself lately, as far as boundaries go--what I would be okay requesting from an author, and what I wouldn't request for fear of stepping on toes.

My personal guidelines on the matter are as follows:

Okay:

A one-time suggestion for a sequel to a story you love, as long as you're not pushy and not telling the author how to write it.

Not as okay:

-Suggestions for specific additions to an already-completed story (i.e. just one or two scenes, not a full sequel).

-Requests for anything that materially changes a work-in-progress: changes/additions/subtractions of pairings that have already been established or hinted at in the story, changes of which characters are/are not present in the story, significant plot-point suggestions (unless specifically requested by the author).

By and large, it's not something I've experienced enough to worry about. I have seen comments on stories similar to what you've mentioned, though, and they have made me scratch my head a little. An author writes a story a certain way for a reason. If they wanted to include a particular character, pairing, or event in the story, I figure they would have done so their own. :)

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

Yeah. You have your people being helpful and who enjoyed your story and want more, then you have your people who seem to get a little too comfortable telling authors what to do. I've never had, for example, people ask me if they could add a pairing or a scene. But as I said in my post I have had people who don't make it any secret that they would prefer my story to include a certain trope popular in my current fandom. Which, okay, I get that the trope is popular but I hate that it's so popular that for some no story is good enough unless it includes that trope. So I bristle a little whenever I feel like readers are trying to nudge me in that tropes direction (although, thankfully, lately I've yet to get such comments).

Most of what I come across is on other peoples stories, and it didn't used to bother me until I started seeing it more.

[afleur-de-lis.livejournal.com]

It is one of my pet peeves to find reviews of that nature on any story, regardless of whether it is mine or not. It angers me a great deal to see writers receive these reviews and feel that in order to keep their readers, they must conform their story into what the readers suggested. To me, it is a crime to see that kind of stuff.

A writer's story should be theirs to write, not the readers. However, that said, I think that these kinds of reviewers fall into two very separate groups. The first group are the readers that have read the story and felt that they were offering advice to the writer with a suggestion of sorts about the story and characters. The second group is reserved for those that are ordering a writer to do something.

The first group I can handle. If it is a suggestion like this for example: "I feel that the story has been dragging on for the last few chapters. It is a great thing that you're adding more to Gwen and Arthur's relationship, but I think that it would be best to move forward and get things moving quickly." I welcome that kind of critique- because that makes me realise that I may be boring my readers to death.

However, I loathe these kinds of reviews: "I like the story but it would be better if Morgana and Merlin got together romantically."

Of course, I've been flamed in the past for pairings. Specifically in the Dumas fandom when the people who only watched the 2011 movie version decided to plague the fandom. I wrote a story that had d'Artagnan with Constance and it was a "romance fluff" if you really want to break things down to genre... and I had a reviewer flame me because I had those two together.

"In the movie, Constance was a bitch. D'Artagnan would not waste his time with a woman like that. It is clear that you don't know how to write in this fandom, just like it is very clear that you don't belong here. I seriously recommend that you remove the story and as quickly as you can. Write out a story with D'Artagnan with an original character or with Anne of Austria."

I was all... say what?

[kriadydragon.livejournal.com]

"In the movie, Constance was a bitch. D'Artagnan would not waste his time with a woman like that. It is clear that you don't know how to write in this fandom, just like it is very clear that you don't belong here. I seriously recommend that you remove the story and as quickly as you can. Write out a story with D'Artagnan with an original character or with Anne of Austria."

Om my gosh that's horrible! o.O I really don't get people like that. If they don't like a certain story or concept, then they need to learn to use the back button and move on. The world does not revolve around only what they like to read.

[afleur-de-lis.livejournal.com]

To say I was shocked would be an understatement. I didn't know what to say or what to think. First, I was a bit dumbfounded. Surely somebody writing for the d'Artagnan romances would have known that the book version had it where d'Artagnan and Constance loved each other. So much so that after her death, d'Artagnan didn't truly move on.

Then I got angry because this user told me that I wasn't a good enough writer for that site and I went after them with a sword in hand.

Funny thing is, that the person who sent me that review is now trolling me and several others on that fandom.

But to bring this topic to what you have said. Yes, I tend to find that these kinds of reviews make authors deflate a bit in their confidence as a writer. They will seriously believe that their writing isn't good enough unless their story has this pairing or goes the way the reviewer wants it to.

Which is infuriating. At least to me. I've lost a lot of readers in the past because I refused to do what they wanted me to do.

People actually comment about me in the reviews they send... or in the PMs. Everybody is under the impression that I am rather intimidating.