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So my BIL andI were talking about TV shows and movies, and it lead into an interesting discussion on how media uses the label of "mature" these days. So, apparently, there's giong to be another Star Trek series. I don't know the details since I didn't read the article. But my BIL was talking about how the person who wrote the article - which was an interview, I believe - asked if this new series was going to be "more mature." And by mature, the write meant dark, gritty, more violent and with more sex. In other words, Game of Thrones in Space.
And my BIL brought up an interesting point, the gist of his point being that this writer's idea of mature, techincally, relies on an atmosphere brought about by immaturity. To get all that violence and unhappiness, you need people who are acting, well, less tha adult - people who are being selfish, self-centered, greedy, angry, petulent and so on. You need characters that are acting anything but mature (for the record, I'm not saying dark and grim and heavily sexual are immature. What I'm saying is that, when you think about it, dark and grim situations usually come about because someone within the story isn't being adult and reasonable).
Another point my BIL made was that Star Trek was already mature, in that it dealt with a lot of mature ideas and philosphies in mature ways. The example he gave was a story-line in Deep Space Nine (mild spoilers ahead though I'll try not to give too much away) in which a character is injured in a life changing way during a battle, forced to sit the battle out while listening to it continue on. The following episode after that battle ep is about the character coming to terms with what happened. He said it had been a really poignant episode for him.
And it got me thinking about how we (and by we I mean writers, people who make TV shows, movies, etc) someitmes get into this habit of thinking that A + B always equals C. If you want a story to be poignant and "grown-up" then it needs to be grimdark. If you want your romance to be romance, then it must have sex. If you want comedy relief in your tale, then it has to have a bumbling idiot. If you want to call your movie a horror movie, then it must always have gore. I'll read fanfic chalked full of all these swears and over-the-top drama, and my immediate thought is whether the author added all of this swearing and drama because they thought it would make their story more "adult." And I usually only think this when the swears or drama don't add anything or keep bogging the story down.
In other words, we get these ideas in our head that for our story to be "this" it has to include or be "that." We get this idea that "mature" means adult situations, but forget that there's more to a story - and in fact life - than blood, guts, and a roll in the sheets. Making a story dark and depressing doesn't automatically mean it earns the title of being mature, most especially if all the dark and depressing is there just for the sake of dark and depressing, and leaving it out would have actually benefitted the story (another example my BIL used were the fight scenes and scenes of violence in Daredevil, and how they sometimes drag out unecessarily). Heck, I've watched cartoons that dealt with some pretty heavy stuff and following through with that stuff in a way that was more grown up than some adult shows.
I think it's rather sad that mature has become synonimous with "mature content." That the only way a show or book can be considered mature or good is if contains content only ever seen on HBO. Again, I'm not trying to put down dark and gritty. I love dark nd gritty. My complaint is toward the idea that dark and gritty is the only way a book can be considered "mature."
And my BIL brought up an interesting point, the gist of his point being that this writer's idea of mature, techincally, relies on an atmosphere brought about by immaturity. To get all that violence and unhappiness, you need people who are acting, well, less tha adult - people who are being selfish, self-centered, greedy, angry, petulent and so on. You need characters that are acting anything but mature (for the record, I'm not saying dark and grim and heavily sexual are immature. What I'm saying is that, when you think about it, dark and grim situations usually come about because someone within the story isn't being adult and reasonable).
Another point my BIL made was that Star Trek was already mature, in that it dealt with a lot of mature ideas and philosphies in mature ways. The example he gave was a story-line in Deep Space Nine (mild spoilers ahead though I'll try not to give too much away) in which a character is injured in a life changing way during a battle, forced to sit the battle out while listening to it continue on. The following episode after that battle ep is about the character coming to terms with what happened. He said it had been a really poignant episode for him.
And it got me thinking about how we (and by we I mean writers, people who make TV shows, movies, etc) someitmes get into this habit of thinking that A + B always equals C. If you want a story to be poignant and "grown-up" then it needs to be grimdark. If you want your romance to be romance, then it must have sex. If you want comedy relief in your tale, then it has to have a bumbling idiot. If you want to call your movie a horror movie, then it must always have gore. I'll read fanfic chalked full of all these swears and over-the-top drama, and my immediate thought is whether the author added all of this swearing and drama because they thought it would make their story more "adult." And I usually only think this when the swears or drama don't add anything or keep bogging the story down.
In other words, we get these ideas in our head that for our story to be "this" it has to include or be "that." We get this idea that "mature" means adult situations, but forget that there's more to a story - and in fact life - than blood, guts, and a roll in the sheets. Making a story dark and depressing doesn't automatically mean it earns the title of being mature, most especially if all the dark and depressing is there just for the sake of dark and depressing, and leaving it out would have actually benefitted the story (another example my BIL used were the fight scenes and scenes of violence in Daredevil, and how they sometimes drag out unecessarily). Heck, I've watched cartoons that dealt with some pretty heavy stuff and following through with that stuff in a way that was more grown up than some adult shows.
I think it's rather sad that mature has become synonimous with "mature content." That the only way a show or book can be considered mature or good is if contains content only ever seen on HBO. Again, I'm not trying to put down dark and gritty. I love dark nd gritty. My complaint is toward the idea that dark and gritty is the only way a book can be considered "mature."
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no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 02:03 am (UTC)From:I don't read it and it burns me up that they just assume, incorrectly, if
I will read mature, then I have to accept it......
no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 07:54 am (UTC)From:(And, okay, I usually just try to brush it off when this happens but this time it really annoyed me, because it always happens every time I make a fic request. Either people aren't reading the request entirely or they're ignoring the "no pairings" part. Whatever the case, it's actually starting to really frustrate me. What part of no pairings don't they understand!
Sorry to vent, it just really got to me).
no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 04:05 pm (UTC)From:Much earlier when I offered to beta for SGA Big Bang...and was
very clear of what I would not beta, including slash, I received numerous requests..
e.g. "Can't you just look past that part?"
I finally pulled my request...by that time had one anyway..the moderator's nose was out of joint that I had done so...I told her I had made myself clear and was
TIRED of being badgered by individuals who apparently could not read..
no subject
Date: 2015-12-07 05:58 pm (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 02:56 am (UTC)From:What I loved about Star Trek was the hope for the future and people getting along; of rational overcoming irrational.
no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 07:57 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 08:50 pm (UTC)From:*shakes head*
no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 04:38 am (UTC)From:It's not that the gritty stuff can't be good and useful to a story. But... just... yeah. Maturity =/= "Mature content."
no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 08:08 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 05:07 am (UTC)From:no subject
Date: 2015-12-06 08:14 am (UTC)From: